By: quintensmith@rocketmail.com
25/11/2008
10:47 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| I go to Sunday school |
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By: jtarr94
25/11/2008
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Onslaught of bible verses does nothing except make me and no doubt you angry...The problem is for christians today, bad teaching, no understanding and rebillion...they do their own thing. They believe the bible as being the infallable word of God but they do not do what Jesus says they should do in it. If they did, you would find that you probably would be more intrested yourself as they would be so different that no one would be able to ignore.
Heck, in the old days people were happy to be fed to lions, or be burnt alive for Jesus...why, they had a different relationship with Jesus..a different understanding of what Christianity was all about..
I don't think that if you took a christian from any church in NZ and asked them are they willing to die for Jesus here and now, many would balk at it.....no way , no way. Why because to many its comfort, apathy and covertness, too happy with the nice life, no problems no stress...overseas is a different matter, young and old are being burnt alive with car tyres around their necks for being christian...christians have it too easy and it will be their downfall. |
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By: ron.tristram@ymail.com
25/11/2008
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| jtarr. I think the point here is that if you throw out the bits about god being jealous and so on, what you have left, the so called Commandments, is what ALL of the successful civilisations use as a basis for their culture, be they Christian, Moslem, Hindu, ...its the only way. This is not to say that someone went up on a mountain, where a god cut out blocks of stone and so on...because that implies that no one knew how to govern themselves at all before this Mosaic event, when in fact they did. |
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By: jtarr94
25/11/2008
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| Ron, agree, christianity for many years has got into themindset of "Don't teach them about the commandement, you're scare them off"...whether you are a 'believer' or not, they are good foundational rules. |
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By: tokoroajaq
25/11/2008
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jtarr94
Interesting theory but my question would be why does God need to make it so difficult for people. He made us right? (According to the faith) Why do we need to burn alive for our faith? Why can't people have nice easy lives and still believe?
Perhaps those people that we lump into the 50% are actually closer to their God then we give them credit for? How are we to know.
All I can say is if they and so many others are not close to God then God needs to change his communication style with us.
Thats my thoughts on it. Then perhaps people will flock to him? Or maybe not? |
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By: jtarr94
25/11/2008
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soz have to go, got a problem to deal with.
Sorry, was beginning to enjoy this. Catch you later Ron.
and anyone else. |
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By: jtarr94
25/11/2008
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soz have to go, got a problem to deal with.
Sorry, was beginning to enjoy this. Catch you later Ron.
and anyone else. |
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By: tokoroajaq
25/11/2008
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| bye jtarr - nice chatting with you. Catch you later. |
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By: quintensmith@rocketmail.com
25/11/2008
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| George? are you in here? |
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By: ron.tristram@ymail.com
25/11/2008
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| I feel sympathetic to what you are saying, jtarr. But I find hope in Humanity and its Aspirations, not some bloodthirsty damn god who loves sacrifice and war, as in the Old Testament. It is no good that the Botherers want to forget about the OT, because it is there, still. And Jesus the man, was a political activist, a bit like Che Guevar, who was eventually executed for his beliefs and like Marx and Lenin and Buddha and many other visionaries, are still read about today. Thank God (with reservations!)for such Men. |
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By: patriciaandjohn@xtra.co.nz
25/11/2008
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jtarr.
nice to read your postings, there are many who profess to be christans, but do not follow the teachings of Christ, a true Christian does not have to constantly prove that they are, in fact it is expressed in the way they live.
It is quite amazing after all these 1000's of postings the same people under different guises repeatedly try to drag down the ones who have deep Christian beliefs.
Thank you for sharing jtarr amidst all of this there have been some really great personal spiritual experiences, which have resulted in an unquestionable belief in God. PJ |
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By: tokoroajaq
25/11/2008
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| PJ - I agree. Its refreshing to have someone that shares based on experience and lifestyle and not just a bible thumper (which is how it comes across to the unsaved like myself). I found jtarrs posts to be very interesting and thought provocking. |
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By: ron.tristram@ymail.com
25/11/2008
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| PJ. Can't say I have noticed these "great spiritual experiences" that you have. And as for "unquestionable belief in God", many of us here would define that as simply wishful thinking and a bit like believing in Santa Claus. |
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By: ron.tristram@ymail.com
25/11/2008
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| jaquie. I do agree....I just hope he does not get sucked down into the religious drain hole where mike and Co live. |
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By: tokoroajaq
25/11/2008
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| But Ron wasn't it a refreshing change to have a believer communicate in a pleasant challenging manner by comparison to others. |
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By: tokoroajaq
25/11/2008
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Ron the fact alone that they need a book to prove the existense of a God - when some 80% (guessing) of the population of the world is illiterate! Doesn't that in itself say that they are so lost.
There so called God suffers in communication skills and if He is real and wants the world to know HIm then He needs to change His approach.
Its easy for me because I do believe there is a battle between good and evil going on but I don't believe there is currently a God thats listening to each and every one of us at a personal level and answering our prayers. Clearly they are not being answered. Well at least not with logical consistancy when God can heal someones headache but allow a child to suffer at the hands of one of his appointed leaders!!!
No, he is not in personal contact with us at all. |
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By: bigpumpkin2006
25/11/2008
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| Ron,As long as Santa keeps bringing me presents,i will still be a believer |
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By: ron.tristram@ymail.com
25/11/2008
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| jaquie. Agreed...jtarr is a polite Christian and he should be cultivated, if that is not too condescending. Such people are valuable. And yes, god needs to work on his communication skills, at present none-existent or rough at best. Really, its a load of hogwash, isn't it? I am not ruling out some supernatural events (had one or two myself) but as a means of talking to all the millions of people in the world, whatever he is trying use is pretty rubbishy. Its either that or there isn't a god that cares very much about humanity, or he is so far away in Time or Space that there is no chance of contact. |
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By: ron.tristram@ymail.com
25/11/2008
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| You shocker, pumpkin! |
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By: patriciaandjohn@xtra.co.nz
25/11/2008
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ron tristram.
well yes, when I was a child I did believe in Santa, but now I am grown up I know the truth.
However as a child I went to Sunday school & believed in Jesus (he was my friend).
The difference is that now I am really grown up, I not only still believe in God but have experienced God's presence in my life for many long years,& have witnessed many healings & miracles. ( one was an actual visual healing, which even the surgeon asked where is this miracle).I can truly tell you they are not fairy stories stories. I am very sad that I cannot let pigpot & many of the other doubters see through my eyes what I have seen & feel the tremendous love in my heart that is nurtered by God's prescence in my life. I try to be a Christian by the way I live, when possible like to share my blessings. PJ |
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By: bigpumpkin2006
25/11/2008
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| Ron, When you say that jtarr should be cultivated. Do you mean by ploughing him into a field . |
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By: dirtysouthagain
25/11/2008
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<<< one was an actual visual healing, which even the surgeon asked where is this miracle >>>
Names? Dates? Published where? Who else witnessed? What was the operation / disability that was cured?
Without this information this claim has zero credibility and can be thrown in the "fairy tales" pile, without producing this information anything YOU say hereafter also lacks any credibility. |
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By: bron.f@xtra.co.nz
25/11/2008
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| " |
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By: bron.f@xtra.co.nz
25/11/2008
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Oops, a little premature ejaculation there. Didn't think it would post such a short message. Oh well. What I meant to say was:
"jtarr is a polite Christian and he should be cultivated, if that is not too condescending"
ron.tristam, in my opinion that is definitely too condescending |
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By: deecee4@xtra.co.nz
25/11/2008
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hi ron
Yes atheists are often compelled to reject the notion of an absolute moral law. A notable exception was Nietzsche, who realised that without God, there are no universal moral values, and, it follows, man is free to create his own values. (It is interesting that the *** 's often referred to Nietzsche's writings for the supposed intellectual justification for their acts of cruelty).
The problem with this is firstly that it is an unsupported presupposition, and secondly that this is not the way moral relativists actually live. They claim this only until they are wronged, and then appeal to an objective and universal law that stands above man. In other words they deny an absolute moral law in words, but live by it in their everyday lives.
excpetion was of course NBut this is a presupposition without foundation; in fact it is moral relativism.
So, |
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