By: deecee4@xtra.co.nz
1/02/2009
4:38 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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hi easy...I'm sure you will agree that I have a better than fair track record of responding to questions, however I have a family and a life outside of these boards, so please don't give me a hard time just because I chose to take my 8 year old daughter out for the afternoon.
Now to the Bombardier Beetle. In response to your reference (originally written in 1997, with links and refernces updated 2003) I would recommend a full rebuttal posted at https://www.apologeticspr ess.org/articles/2102 in 2003. This rebuttal is comprehensive, so I will not repeat it here. However one pertinent point is that the author of your refernce, Mark Isaak, provides "a step-by step process in which he gave a hypothetical explanation of how this complex design could have arrived via chance processes." This process has no less than 15 steps! And here's the biggest problem I have (and any thinking person should have!) with this. This beetle emits this 'pulse defense' (at 100 degrees c no less!). This involves explosive chemicals, inhibitor, enzymes, glands, combustion tubes, sensory communication, muscles to direct the combustion tubes and reflex nervous systems all operating in sync, without which it is almost certain that the beetle would be defenseless and possibly fried. Yet evolution demands that this process took place over eons of chance and random processes. Ridiculous! |
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By: easypeasysaintandgreavsie
1/02/2009
5:37 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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I, as you are well aware, do not believe in anything deecee.
But evolution has been proved the equal to your creationist theory. I am sorry for you!
To Tok, no it is not! |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
5:39 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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To Tok, no it is not!
Easy - no it is not what? Sorry you have lost me. |
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By: easypeasysaintandgreavsie
1/02/2009
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| Hard being me!! Keep up Tok!! No wonder the Church gets hold of people like you:) |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
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| How rude! |
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By: easypeasysaintandgreavsie
1/02/2009
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| Rudeness is defined by your own ego Tok. What if the statement were true though? |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
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| God bless you easypeasy. I said a prayer for you today at church. The Lord loves you! And your anger is a result of your constant running from Him. |
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By: deecee4@xtra.co.nz
1/02/2009
6:15 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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hi zaax...the point of the bombardier beetle (and other such examples) is that they make evolution so implausible, if not impossible, in those particular cases. So even if evolution was a viable explanation for some life forms (and I am by no means convinced of this), there is a strong implication of design amongst living things. And of course design implies a designer.
Natural selection is interesting insofar as micro evolution is concerned. However I remain deeply sceptical of the idea that natural adaption experienced within a single species (or 'kind' as the Bible puts it) can be applied, as is the implication, to one species turning into another. So I can fully understand a zonkey (the cross between a donkey and a zebra) but this is still an equid. However we have no evidence of a donkey becoming a whale, or vice versa.
I am also looking closer at the idea of irreducible complexity, proposed by biochemist Michael Behe in his book 'Darwin's Black Box'. This theory has been around for about 15 years now, and argues that some "biological systems are too complex to have evolved from simpler, or "less complete" predecessors, through natural selection acting upon a series of advantageous naturally occurring chance mutations". [http://en.wikipedia.org/ wiki/Irreducible_complexi ty] While obviously biased toward intelligent design, this is worth a look, because Behe is no slouch.
The age of the earth posited by young earth creationists is (I understand) based on the geneologies of the Bible, and in particular the work of Bishop Ussher. Their view is that the science fits this age when considered in the light of flood geology, AND plate tectonics etc (as you point out).
I tend to feel that Gap Creationists and Progressive Creationists are either compromising good science for poor theology or good theology for poor science. I am more likely to fit into the young earth or day age/old earth camps, but my opinion is not yet set. |
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By: raccoon2520
1/02/2009
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Evening all. I follow this thread daily but seldom share on it however having just seen the post from tokoroajag regarding prayer I feel that I need to let you know easypeasy that my church also pray for you daily and our hope is that one day you will give up this sad, destructive struggle and rest in the loving arms of your creator the Lord Jesus Christ.
I will not enter into a discussion with you over this. You have enough people answering your questions. But know that you are loved and prayed for. I imagine this thread is watched by other Christians and other churches as well. I don't mind betting you are being prayed for by a great many. May you feel His peace in your life.
Bless ya |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
6:23 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| Awww easypeasy-nastyteasy you have friends praying for you and you didn't even know it. |
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By: magewizard@rocketmail.com
1/02/2009
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| have a feeling he won't be happy! |
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By: easypeasysaintandgreavsie
1/02/2009
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I also feel sorry for you Tok.
You are very apparently not the sharpest knife in the drawer. I used to think you would grow up and not be convinced by the sh1t you have been fed.
Still when I look at it logically, you were always ripe pickings. Carry on Tokoroajaq, you have pulled the pin that kept you attached to the Sensible Train yourself.
Carry on your silly little gamble of wasting your life praying to something you cannot PROVE. You fell for it like all the others and then start spouting the same drivel as the rest, that, "God loves you."
Sorry Tok. god can go SCREW himself!!!
Think for yourself!!!!!! That would make a nice change. |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
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| Loving the anticipation! |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
6:27 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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god can go SCREW himself!!! - to make that statement you admit his reality. You are getting closer to the truth. This is good news and God doesn't mind us being angry with Him. He would prefer that then us ignore him.
So telling him to screw himself is really you talking to Him at an angry level. Progress indeed! |
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By: magewizard@rocketmail.com
1/02/2009
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mmmmmmmmm
this could prove interesting. |
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By: raccoon2520
1/02/2009
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MAGE - hahahaha decided I would join in the fun of multi sign ons! SORRY easypeasy-nastyteasy - my church aren't really praying for you.
RFLMAO !!!
TOKJAQ99 |
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By: deecee4@xtra.co.nz
1/02/2009
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| hi easy...to say you belive in nothing is just nonsense easy. Not everything you hold to be true can be empirically verified (including the non-existence of God), so therefore you do 'believe' some things. |
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By: easypeasysaintandgreavsie
1/02/2009
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Couldn't give two f()cks mage. How sad are these people?
Praying for me! They don't know me or whether I've a c()ck or toot!!! They only think they do!
Very sad people. Oh!! And the funniest thing I've found is that why would God being so omnipotent, give himself a name like Jesus Christ? Why not something huge or not bother at all?
Then again the whole religion thing doesn't make sense, so what the hell!!! |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
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Well that was fun. BUt I am back as the real me.
TOKJAQ99 |
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By: magewizard@rocketmail.com
1/02/2009
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wow orange, intelligible english below, wouldn't have guessed that was you , was fairly sure about haahaa though.
Theres hope for you yet!
lol |
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By: easypeasysaintandgreavsie
1/02/2009
6:33 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Yes Tok, you are a tw@t!!! deecee, there you go again. TELLING people what they know and do. The reason you do this deecee is because you are lacking in something in life!!!
Please tell us what you are lacking! |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
6:34 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| mage - read again!!! Tis not Orange - tis I. |
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By: easypeasysaintandgreavsie
1/02/2009
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No Tok!! That wasn't fun or funny!!! It was sh1t and lame!
Get a life. PLEEEEEEAAAAAASSSSE!!! |
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By: magewizard@rocketmail.com
1/02/2009
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ick.
yet another bad call from the wiz.
what gives.
somethings awry.
what could it be? |
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By: tokoroajaq
1/02/2009
6:38 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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mage - perhaps the wand has a k-ink in it?
Easypeasy-nastyteasy - I think its funny and infact I am still rolling of the floor laughing! |
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