By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
10:30 am Yahoo! Profile:
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Just wondering if anyone here has read Martin Doutre's book of the same name?
From what I can gather about this book, he claims among other things that:
* Ancient Celts/Vikings new of and visted NZ sometime in 1200 AD.
* There is "evidence" of an ancient stone "city" in Waipoua.
* That Maori Pa forts are an "exact duplication of pre-Celtic hill forts".
* He asks: How did Polynesians, without access to metal tools, fashion and shape incredibly hard greenstone or intricately carve wood in distinctly pre-Celtic patterns and styles?
Apparently, anyone who challenges his theories are immediately labled as Marxists, or are pushing some type of PC agenda.
Does anyone here take this stuff seriously, and if so, why? |
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By: mar_ja@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
10:34 am Yahoo! Profile:
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hi Mozzarella,
all the information you have listed has been posted several times on the posts in regards to Indigineity and prove and disprove who was in NZ first, over the last two weeks, all got torn to bits, debated, thrashed lol, but hey who knows, freedom of expression and opinions, maybe someone has something different to say. |
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By: mar_ja@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
10:37 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| The Moriori Myth and the When can Pakeha be regarded as indigenous, just two examples, no disrespect intended, maybe they might also appear on the two cannibalism posts as well lol. |
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By: gvtstkwi08
28/08/2008
10:38 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| the vikings probably came here after the maori but got wasted along with all the other ethnic groups that try to make a claim here.Its pure and simple the British knew they couldnt win over the maoris here in war and friendship so they did the nxt best thing and that was make peace and therefore the treaty came about. |
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By: gvtstkwi08
28/08/2008
10:42 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| All the other evidence of other ethinc groups that came means absolutely nothing!!!!!!Only the maori and pakeha survived,everyone that came before the british were all sh!t so i really dnt know why people are trying too relive people that came because they are gone,dead and burried |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
10:43 am Yahoo! Profile:
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In that case, the challenge I would like to put forward to all who post here is to:
* Not use personal attacks as that proves that you have run out of anything intelligent to say.
* Be prepared to back up your opinions with as much FACT as you can muster.
* Respect other peoples opinions. |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
10:47 am Yahoo! Profile:
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I'm not interested in who is or isn't indiginous - what I want to know is who belives that ancient Celts/Vikings where in NZ around 1200 AD and why you believe this.
You can agree or disagree - the point of this thread is to use intelligence and reason to argue your point. |
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By: gvtstkwi08
28/08/2008
10:54 am Yahoo! Profile:
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people are fed up with old tired news about who should of been here first ,its boring and old old news.The history of the Maori people in Nz is well documented.The Vikings did what here???The Spanish did what here?????.What influenece did they have in the past????
How many maori spoke spanish before the british came?How many battle helmets,shields and viking stlye boats did the maori have before the british have?What stlye foods were introduced to the Maori by the Spanish and the viking??um let me see.......NONE,you could say they never exisisted here! |
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By: waynebeau@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
10:56 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| Ross Wiseman published two interesting books about pre Tasman explorers. You may find them at your local Library. He put forward some pretty interesting theories and also used a spot of creative imagination. |
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By: smiley_scottie
28/08/2008
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I wouldn't claim to have been here first, but I am an ancient celt who is here now.
My opinion is that it doesn't really matter to anyone other than those who are interested and study Celtic/Viking history whether they came here at all.
What evidence, if any validated, of their potential visit that may remain is of no consquence in contributing to the history of these islands. |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
11:05 am Yahoo! Profile:
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waynebeau
Thanks for your input, but the point of this thread is to argue either for or against the preposition that ancient Celts/Vikings visited NZ, not to plug this or that book. |
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By: kether93
28/08/2008
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| The same could be said about your te puna. There is factual evidence in Scotland of early scots living here before the maori or moriori, why won't the maori allow carbon dating on those heads that were returned, what are they afraid of?. Lets not forget the portugese traders of those times or even the phonecian evidence that has been found here. Maybe the maori are afraid they might have to give land back if there hearsay evidence is overturned. |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
11:13 am Yahoo! Profile:
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kether93
What "factual evidence" are you talking about? You've completely missed point of this thread!
You need to make some type of effort to argue your point - don't just push your own agenda.
Can you prove or at least argue intelligently that Maori have the political ability to prevent scientific carbon dating? |
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By: grizzco2004
28/08/2008
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| gvtstkwi08 Agreed the topic is getting a bit old and well beaten, But I have to take issue with one of your statements "The Spanish did what here?????.What influence did they have in the past????" There are a fear few Ginger haired Maori floating around up North Who can trace a fair bit of Spanish Blood in their history. It seem the Spanish weren't backward when it came to spreading a bit of love around, If you know what I mean Randy little Buggers .And as far as the Author Martin Doutre Goes , His site is linked to a well known Conspiracy Theorists site in the US!! http://www.view *** /Need I say More the guy is a conspiracy theorist , And theory is NOT FACT! |
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By: grizzco2004
28/08/2008
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| That should be VIEWZ,O,N,E,com with out the comers Damned Censorship program It's a GOVT, Plot i tell you |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
11:24 am Yahoo! Profile:
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grizzco2004
You've also missed the point. Red or Ginger hair proves nothing because this occurs naturally in approximately 1% - 2% of the human population world wide, including parts of Asia and Africa.
What's your point?
COME ON PEOPLE MAKE AN EFFORT! |
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By: gvtstkwi08
28/08/2008
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| spreading the love....i like it no harm in that lol |
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By: grizzco2004
28/08/2008
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| smiley_scottie, Like you my friend I have blood links back to Scotland ,Direct descendant of Robert the Bruce And the Robertson Clan of the Highlands , I'm also descended from Eric The Red of Nordic fame , And like you I don't give a *** ly Sporran as to who got here first In my view we are all KIWI's |
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By: grizzco2004
28/08/2008
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| mozzarella68, I know the hair colour is no proof, But if You go and Talk to the elders up there, They will tell you and in at least two cases (I know of ) Show you their Ancestry |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
11:39 am Yahoo! Profile:
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grizzco2004
Congratulations on your interesting historical bloodlines, unfortunately, it doesn't mean anything here!
Again, this post isn't about who got here first or who is or isn't indigenous or whether or not "we" are all Kiwi's, the point is to argue that the ancient Celts/Vikings visted NZ in 1200 AD and to do so with intelligence.
Sorry, but your post gets an F. You'll have to re-sit the exam. |
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By: smiley_scottie
28/08/2008
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We Scots, and other northern invaders would like to believe we have been everywhere, but in respect of New Zealand, does it really matter?
Whoever may have "been" here before those credited as being the original settlers, obviously were just "passers by".
If there had been anything, anything at all, to suggest other peoples settled and lived here, it would have been well documented by now and we would been given conclusive evidence. It is not as if New Zealand is that huge.
I, for one, am quite happy to concede these islands were first occupied by those of polynesian descent.
We ancient celts have our own islands, but are rather pleased that we are tolerated elsewhere. |
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By: bubble33@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
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Hell the maori would not want the world to know they werent the first otherwise their meal ticket would dry up..
And they are lucky the spanish didnt take hold here as they would of wiped them out!
But the celtic idea should be investigated...they found that 300 year old european skull not that long ago...??? |
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By: mar_ja@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
11:52 am |
Message deleted. Reason: Breach of terms of service |
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By: bubble33@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
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I think you need to re read my answer mar ja, I said "Maori would not want the world to know if they were not the first people here..."
I dont have any evidence so I dont know what you mean..?? |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
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bubble33
I also give your post a grade of F for poor effort, and overextended use of conjecture. |
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