By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
1:28 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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mike_f596
Now we're getting somewhere! Welcome to the thread.
You make a valid point. Common sense and necessity is the mother of many an invention.
We can see that as weapon technology advanced through the ages, that the defence strategies changed also in response, and not in just one part of the world either.
Im not convinced that Celts from the 1200's would have much use for features found in some musket pa i.e. staggered trenches or earthworks designed to reduce the shokwave of cannons since the necessity for these things didn't exist in 1200 AD given that this technology was not perfected for general use in warfare until at least the 1600's. |
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By: theburtonfamily@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
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Whether the vikings were here first or not it does not matter, as the ethnic people of New Zealand feel so weak that any voices about the vikings are quickly shut up.
you are not aloud to talk about this stuff fullstop or you will be seen as rascist.
thats the way it is.
why else would they play african and negro programmes on maori television. they are trying to be linked with other cultures to make themselves feel stronger.
though fact is that they are a dying breed of people.
that is sad but fact. |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
1:38 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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burton
I have a couple of questions for you:
* If the ancient Celts or Vikings made it here, then which route did they take? If we are to believe that they got here in one generation, then they must have had prior knowledge of the existence of NZ. Where is this evidence?
* If they got here over a period of generations, as is common with human migration, then it is not unreasonable to expect to find evidence of settlements along the migration path. Where is this evidence?
When the Vikings invaded the UK they settled in the Shetlands to the north of Scotland, so even the Vikings themselves follow this pattern of migration and settlement.
Too bad you had to spoil your best attempt at making sense by bringing up Maori television. |
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By: mike_f596
28/08/2008
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burt .. whether they were or not does not matter .. did we ask if it matters ?
the discussion is .. about the possibility .
the only reason i can see for viking type peoples to have happened on this peice of land would be exactly that .. they happened ... i mean to be so far they would have to have discovered a lot of places and resupply their ships or be desperately lost .. but then they would not likely survive on landing here .. also from whom would they be defending themselves to have built such a fort .
I don't know much of their culture but its believed that for them ,to die in battle, was a great way to go, so it would not make to much sense (if that's true ) for a ship of vikings to hole up in a fort and try to survive . |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
1:42 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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RULES OF ENGAGEMENT
The preposition of this thread is that the Ancient Celts/Vikings visited NZ sometime around 1200 AD as suggested by Martin Dourtre. Refer to page 1.
Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to use reason and intelligence to argue the point one way or the other.
I don't actually care what your point is. I only care that you make an effort to argue it intelligently.
With that in mind please observe the following rules of engagement:
* Do not make personal attacks since this only proves
that you have run out of anything intelligent to say.
* Make an effort to argue your point, don't just push
your own agenda with pointless conjecture.
* Try to use as much factual information as possible i.e.
something that can be corroborated.
* Respect other peoples opinions. |
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By: mike_f596
28/08/2008
1:42 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| oh ..ok MOZZ " you said it way beter haha |
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By: charlie_studd
28/08/2008
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| Big yawn MOzilla |
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By: solutionz@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
1:44 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| ...ood Mozz eh....the melting, strigy, stretchy cheese........little goes a long way |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
1:48 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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charlie
Big yawn? Did I wake you? Go back to sleep... |
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By: mozzarella68
28/08/2008
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solutionz
lol...yeah, ok - but ask your mamma about my special cheese ;-) |
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By: theburtonfamily@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
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o.k. sweet then
you will know that vikings quite often had religeous beliefs. they would place i think it was a bunch of leaves and flowers maybe from memmory, into the sea where they intended on landing. they would then follow that to where it came to hit the shore then they would land there.
this according to the History channel is how iceland became.
obviously the vikings would have stumbled accross NZ while out fishing or exploring or maybe they followed the spanish guy that lost his helmet in wellington harbour
Mozz u get a f |
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By: lisachittick
28/08/2008
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mikef5something
I would love to enlighten you all with facts but I do not have them at hand. Much of Maori history as with many other races is Oratory. History and geneology recited by story and song etc. But for those truly interested in this topic of Nga Tangata Whenua, it is advisable to read all material available. |
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By: grizzco2004
28/08/2008
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mozzarella68, You seem to be under the impression That I or any body else here gives a toss Where, what or who you think you are 1) this is not a class room ,there for YOU are not a Teacher and I am not one of your poor miss guided pupils 2)You are no real authority on historical events ,you've based most of this drivel on a book that for the most part is bases on theory with only one piece of evidence to back his claims ,And that is sketchy at best
So enough with the Holier than thou B/S (the rules of engagement)If you want a genuine Debate go to your local UNI but don't be supprised if you are laughed at repeatedly |
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By: lisachittick
28/08/2008
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| Te Reo is everywhere. And you use it everyday. Tauranga, Taupo, Rotorua etc etc. |
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By: lisachittick
28/08/2008
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| That was a reply for The Burton Family. |
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By: solutionz@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
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..It is quite logical that Maori decended from the Vikings...check out some of the possible names
Bjorn Lazy
Bjorn Moaning
etc...................jok ing whanau...only joking......p.h.a.r.k.... ..!!!! |
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By: cunningfoxnz
28/08/2008
2:09 pm |
Message deleted. Reason: Breach of terms of service |
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By: mike_f596
28/08/2008
2:11 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| lol .. come on grizz fair go .. what do you reckon tho? did viking come here , is it plausible ? |
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By: theburtonfamily@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
2:15 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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either way, handwriting is far more important than learning how to talk at winz.
handwriting is more important way of communicating than speaking jibberish.
that only a handfull of people know.
even on the outakes of most of the maori tv programmes shows you announsers laughing trying to read te reo and not being able to do so. check out howard morrison juniors hunting show. he has heaps of mispronounciation probs.
what a waste of time
whats more important for your children to learn. maths or maori? |
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By: lisachittick
28/08/2008
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mozarella68; to answer your question; no I have not read the book Ancient Celtic NZ. Many of the points that he has noted, I do find plausible.
What happened to this race would be interesting to learn.
Intermarriage with the immigraters?
Or defeat by conflict? |
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By: mar_ja@xtra.co.nz
28/08/2008
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Mozarella:
Do you have any other information? It would be interesting if you do. |
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By: gvtstkwi08
28/08/2008
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in previous posts it was mentioned that some of the fortified villages and strategic placing of defense were from viking stratergies,how do you know that it wasnt maori stratergies and maori know how?Polynesians came from the far far east,sailing and Island hopping way before they got to the land of the great white cloud.
Alot of you people have forgotton how magnificent navigators,hunters and survivers the polynesian are.They could of swarmed through Europe picking up a few scottsman and vikings along the way and said for them 'hey cuz we going for a cruise down south you wanna hitch a ride?"
The land of new zealand would of been too dense for alot of foreign travellers ,i mean their would of been no cows,sheep or goats to clear the land .The maoris would of just cruised up and down the coast line and using rivers as motorways where the pakehas just take the short cut through the land making more work for themselves |
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By: lisachittick
28/08/2008
2:45 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| cunningfox- if te reo is only a few years old, how did the maori communicate? |
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By: sposer72
28/08/2008
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| I think if vikings etc had arrived it would have been more accidental than anything.There would surely be more evidence around if they had come here en masse.Thats not to say a small number did not land here and were forced to survive here,it might explain why there is some claimed evidence of stone buildings etc.I hope some evidence turns up just for interests sake but at the moment its a bit like the yeti or loch ness monster, there doesnt seem to be enough proof.Just my thoughts tho i havent done any research. |
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By: hairybackrazor
28/08/2008
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Re: Myth of Ancient Celtic New Zealand (REVIEW)
Maori eats all the Vikings, eats all the Celts, hides all the evidence, eats a Scandanavian woman but leaves the skull.
Cor blimey Maoris are such good eaters.
Q - Why didn't the Chinese come down also?
A - Because white meatballs taste better than yellow ones!
Ha ha ha!
Another good thread 'Yeti found in the Urewera'
Wow! |
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