By: asbanc07
12/07/2008
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| Of course you are all overlooking the original 5 tribes of inhabitants of NZ whome the Maori killed off. I refer to those (one of them a supposed white tribe). All the rubbish about Maori being the rightful owners of NZ stinks. This is the biggest scam the world has ever seen. Check out old remnants uncovered in Manawatu and Canterbury and ask why those sites are closed off to the public. To protect Maori interests and outrageous claims. |
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By: wapn@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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| The Treaty needs to be taught at schools all through NZ and it needs to be made compulsory and implemented every year into the ciriculum. It is something that everyone residing in this country should know and understand. It's about partnership and we will never achieve that if so many NZ'ers don't know what they're talking about. |
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By: ngatuwairangi
12/07/2008
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| Tena koe Juney, I tautoko your panui but don't lower yourself to his standards he's not worth it. Unfortunately, it is because of people like this very arrogant man that maori are suffering the consequences of the past. We are the tangata whenua of this land, and we have every right to have the return of what was taken from us - and that also includeds our heritage and reo. |
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By: ngatuwairangi
12/07/2008
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| I totally agree. A compulsory part of the curriculum in Primary, Secondary, Tertiary. And all new immigrants to the country should also have to go through a course on the Treaty before being allowed residency!!!! |
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By: powley9
12/07/2008
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| spending enough money on crazy ideas use it for toilet paper and get on with life its old old history no meaning at all today just get the money and piss it up so we can get on with it please. |
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By: powley9
12/07/2008
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| the whole stupid carry on is poor urban maori who need it dont get nothing but one already living in paradise get it all |
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By: licorice2@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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| I agree that all New Zealanders should learn about the Treaty of Waitangi, it is the founding document of New Zealand, by which settlers were allowed to come to New Zealand. The Treaty agreement was made between the Crown and Maori not anybody else. So any fairy tales about prior ownership of New Zealand by any other race is just a fairy tale. Not all Iwi did sign the Treaty, but the Crown took it that the majority signed so the Treaty became a done deal. Yes Britain wanted the resources New Zealand had, the Treaty was the only way to get them, at the time of signing there were 125,000 Maori and only 2000 settlers. Do you really think Maori couldnt have wiped out the settlers if they wanted to? It was suppose to be a partnership arrangement, but that Maori would still have sovereinty over their land and people. Greed for resources and land lead pakeha to ignore the agreement they had made. From 1840-1860 the Treaty was mostly adhered to after that the land wars came, law had been established and a settler government. The land laws made it almost impossible for Maori to retain its own land. Reservations were created for Maori but not enough to sustain them, the Maori population dropped as they were alienated from their own land, culture changed, diseases brought in by settlers took its toll killing thousands of Maori especially the measles epidemic, almost wiped out Kai Tahu. This is just a wee glimpse into New Zealand history. The results of this history is what is argued about today, the grievances of the Treaty that was not adhered to. Today more and more young Maori are becoming educated, history will rewrite itself the first time a Maori becomes the Prime minister of NZ, and this will happen. Look at whats happening in the USA, Barrack Obama may become their first black president, what do you think that will do for the African American, it will make them rise to their potential. |
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By: thetrolls@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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I totally agree. I would love to see someone with some money take the treaty to court. A decent lawyer should be able to rip it to pieces. I do not think that something from 200 years ago should have such a devastating economical impact today. Settlements are costing too much and that money could be better spent on education, health and police. My understanding was that a large part of the treaty was to prevent the maori from killing themselves off as was threatening to happen at the time.
I have no problem with the return of land and compensation for land confiscated (either illegally or not returned as promised. Anyone who is familiar with the Musket Wars and early european NZ history (I have a book printed in 1927 of life (Maori and pakeha) in Gisborne which is a real eye opener) will know how irrelavent the present interpretation of the treaty is.
Also the cries for maori to have maori justice... I say go for it if it is genuine - as they were eaten for even slight wrongdoings.
I also think that as there are no true maori left that claims are worthless. My father sold the family house for a priiance - yet I cannot now claim for more or that the sale was unjust. What happened happened - let it rest. But I also think that the maori culture has not meshed with the modern mix of culture as well as it could do. There is a lot of preduce caused by a few telling the others to feel hard done by. I too would claim if someone would pay me to and I had a chance of getting something for free. How can the treaty be taught when the trachers do not have a full understanding of it? You must look at what was taking place at the time and the use of language at the time. ANd that not all tribes signed the treaty. |
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By: abu2@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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thetrolls...
you are another who needs to do some reading... the treaty has a huge legal history and has been argued in courts up to the privy council... you should look that up... the results would surprise you...
gazza dude...
you are still confused buddy... not once have I said Europeans shouldn't have come here... and for the record I never would, had said I love my Irish/Scottish/English ancestry... this conversation is about understanding... and too support the cliche' you come back with the standard Maori owe their comfortable life to us pakeha chestnut... when Maori and europeans first had contact with each other live in europe was pretty yucky, we have all come along way... but you obviously want Maori to have frozen and remain in 1840??? |
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By: wapn@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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Powley
Your lack of education and ignorance regarding the Treaty is sad. You are a good example of someone that doesn't understand what they're talking about. Maybe you should go do some Treaty training and then come back and join the discussion at a later date. |
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By: kiwi_gurl53
12/07/2008
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Hello gazza_dude...Which history book did you get
that comment out of i really would like to read it,
Please can i have the name of it....It seems i am
being taught some thing else.... |
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By: powley9
12/07/2008
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| treaty training what a waste of time that would be i understand enough thank you you better get it sorted soon because our asian friends wont have a bar of it so when they are in control and one day they will be look out they just dont see any point in special tratment. |
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By: ngatuwairangi
12/07/2008
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| BE CAREFUL ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, YOU'RE AN OUT AND OUT RACIST WITH A PEA SIZE BRAIN WHO IS OBVIOUSLY JEALOUS THAT IWI ARE NOW BECOMING THE MOST WEALTHY STAKEHOLDERS IN OUR COUNTRY. VERY SOON - YOU STUPID IGNORANT MAN, YOU WILL BE ANSWERABLE TO MAORI LANDLORDS - TAKE A LOOK AT THE WORTH OF THE CNI COLLECTIVE AGREEMENT SIGNED 2 WEEKS AGO!!!! |
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By: powley9
12/07/2008
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| iwi ha ha they will soon sell that for some magic beans they wont be my landlords bro not in this lifetime . |
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By: jerry_springer_room
12/07/2008
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| Oh the collective..... is Stalin involved!!! New Zealand is small potatoes. After you have finished arguing internally; you wont have noticed that you have been over taken by the Asians. Then your Maori language wont be important because you will have to communicate in Chinnese. NZ is so internally focused you can't even see your own ar5e. |
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By: powley9
12/07/2008
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| they will be able to grow good weed thats for sure i will give them that. |
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By: obrienke28
12/07/2008
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Dont forget the other things owned by Maori.
Most of the prisons. Well at least 85% of them anyway.And I look forward to a super crop of Gorse returning to the hill sides when next travelling on my whiteman whaka thru the CNI |
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By: wapn@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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Powley
If you are not interested in the Treaty, what are you doing here then? You are out of your knowledge depth and the only way you can create a debate is by criticising, so far nothing you have said has any substance to it!! |
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By: powley9
12/07/2008
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| must be hitting a raw nerve wapn the iwi can have central plateu if they want it but people cant talk about having seperate maori state without having a blood bath and i for one dont want that |
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By: wapn@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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Powley
It's not a raw nerve at all, I think you are just not in a position to be making such broad statements when you clearly don't have the very basic understanding of the Treaty. It's not about Maori, it's about partnership and pakeha did not approach the Treaty of Waitangi agreement with the right intentions. It is a living document that has to be upheld, why should that agreement be pushed aside and yet we abide by all of our other laws, acts, etc. |
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By: powley9
12/07/2008
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| so does the rest of the world you cant live in the past to survive you have to become modern you wont last long being tribal just get eaten alive by the real world which is rapidly coming here |
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By: abu2@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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| so true powley we need to all be modern... and the modern world has multi cutures and a lot of difference and that is exciting... we all need to learn to live together, and I suspect you are going to need to adjust dramatically... I have no problem with the increased Asian population... |
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By: powley9
12/07/2008
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| lucky i am out of the main centres so it will take a while i too dont have a problum with asians but they are a lot tougher than us dumb easy going pakehas |
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By: wapn@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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| It's not about being tribal and as far as the rest of the world coming here goes... They need to respect our culture if they choose to be here. |
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By: cammo1@xtra.co.nz
12/07/2008
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| My knowledge of the treaty is basically no knowledge except for the land handbacks etc. We were taught nothing about it at school at all and I think that is a shame as from where I sit it just looks like hand-out after hand-out which has no end. I am sure if I knew more about it I would have a more open view. |
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